Carpet on the tunnel
Moderators: GAHorn, Karl Towle, Bruce Fenstermacher
Carpet on the tunnel
This time, I searched the forum first
There is pretty good conversations about installing carpet when it comes to glue vs velcro vs snaps or glue.
What I can't find is a discussion about cutting the holes for the flap handle and trim wheel.
How are people doing these areas and making it look nice?
I don't have anything to go by as my plane previously had vinyl glued to the tunnel and looked terrible.
I don't want to glue the whole thing down as that would make inspection a real pain. I'm thinking about a few trim screws in the low sides of the tunnel to hold the carpet in place.
I tried screwing the flap inspection plate down over the carpet but, I'm not impressed with how that looks.
So, how have others trimmed their carpet around the flap and trim?
-David
There is pretty good conversations about installing carpet when it comes to glue vs velcro vs snaps or glue.
What I can't find is a discussion about cutting the holes for the flap handle and trim wheel.
How are people doing these areas and making it look nice?
I don't have anything to go by as my plane previously had vinyl glued to the tunnel and looked terrible.
I don't want to glue the whole thing down as that would make inspection a real pain. I'm thinking about a few trim screws in the low sides of the tunnel to hold the carpet in place.
I tried screwing the flap inspection plate down over the carpet but, I'm not impressed with how that looks.
So, how have others trimmed their carpet around the flap and trim?
-David
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Re: Carpet on the tunnel
Upholstery shops have a machine that "serges" the raw edges by sewing a border on the carpet. There is also a liquid that seals the raw edges and helps keep the carpet from unravelling but I don't know what it is called. Upholstery shops will know about either option.
Richard Pulley
2014-2016 TIC170A Past President
1951 170A, N1715D, s/n 20158, O-300D
2023 Best Original 170A at Sault Ste. Marie
Owned from 1973 to 1984.
Bought again in 2006 after 22 years.
It's not for sale!
2014-2016 TIC170A Past President
1951 170A, N1715D, s/n 20158, O-300D
2023 Best Original 170A at Sault Ste. Marie
Owned from 1973 to 1984.
Bought again in 2006 after 22 years.
It's not for sale!
Re: Carpet on the tunnel
I had my plane upholstered in Mena, AR. Asked the shop to cover the tunnel with the same material as the carpet. They glued it down over the entire tunnel area. Holes were cut in the fabric around the flap handle and trim tab control areas. The flap handle cover (Fig.20-37) and trim tab cover (Fig.20-38)...on my '55 model this is a single cover plate.... was covered in leather to match the seats. The cover was then attached, to the tunnel, over the hole with upholstery screws. It looks great and has held up for 5 years so far. The shop did not serge the fabric edges and it has not unravelled yet. Every annual, I pull this large cover plate off to check the flap mechanism, cables, pulleys, fuel lines, fuel selector valve, etc. Again the fabric edges are not unravelling.
Jim Wildharber, Kennesaw, GA
Past President TIC170A (2010-12) and Georgia Area Representative
'55 170B, N3415D, SN:26958, O-300D; People's Choice '06 Kelowna, B.C., Best Modified '07 Galveston, TX, Best Modified '08 Branson, MO.
Past President TIC170A (2010-12) and Georgia Area Representative
'55 170B, N3415D, SN:26958, O-300D; People's Choice '06 Kelowna, B.C., Best Modified '07 Galveston, TX, Best Modified '08 Branson, MO.
Re: Carpet on the tunnel
David, There are several ways to skin this cat, depending upon the quality of the carpet you install.
"Loop" pile carpet is not a good candidate for airplanes, in my opinion. The loops can catch on items like sliding seats, cargo, some belt-clasps, etc., and pull-out or destroy the loop(s) leaving your carpet with a damaged appearance.
Short "cut" pile is best for airplanes, the best material being natural fibers such as wool or horsehair (if you can find it.) The Model T Ford collectors use an excellent replacement product which mimics horsehair but is made of wool. It makes a good carpet because it looks like what Cessna originally installed, it wears well and passes the burn test.
My carpet is made of that, and was cut and serged by an upholstery shop.
Serging can be done in several ways, the most common being a "whipped" serge/edging, done by sewing-machine. This looks nice and can be closely matched to the carpet base-color...but it has a disadvantage....the whipping cord/threads suffer the same fate as loop-pile carpet. They can "catch" and be torn loose, leaving you with a raggedy-looking edge which detracts from the appearance. Alongside seat tracks that type of serging usually wears quickly and becomes unsightly.
Another method is to use "serging tape" ....which is similar to what seamstresses use called "sizing tape". Carpet makers are usually familiar with it. Some of it is self-adhesive (I don't like that)...the best method is to have it sewn to the edge of the carpet. This is much more durable than other methods, in my opinion, and is how mine was done.
The carpet on the tunnel can be carefully cut, serged and and glued directly to the non-removeable portions of the tunnel....and can be glued to the cover or left loose in other areas (as well as the main area of carpet which will be regularly removed during inspections) then can be screwed or velcroed directly to the floor. My main carpet is actually loose on the floor, being held in position by the rear seat, pilot seats, tracks, and pilot/co-pilot pedal scuff-pads which are stainless plates screwed to the floor.
To better illustrate this method, here's a pic of the tunnel cover and flap-handle area...as well as a shot of the main floor directly behind the pilot's seat, alongside the seat track.
You might also notice the flap-handle "boot" I have. In order to discourage rodents searching for scraps, as Captain of my ship, I don't allow anyone to eat food in the airplane.
This rule is sometimes ignored by the Admiral, and on the way to Benton-Harbor last year she pulled a can of mixed nuts out of her purse and began to open it up. I stopped her and told her why I didn't want anythng other than water or coffee consumed in-flight. She gave me big sad eyes and promised not to drop a SINGLE NUT in the airplane...and I detailed again how important I thought keeping mice out of stored airplanes can be, in order to further emphasize how important I thought it that she not drop a SINGLE nut...as doubtless it would roll around and drop below the floor making it almost impossible to find/remove.
Sad eyes won.
The can was opened, and as a gesture of good-will...she held the can towards me in an offer of "first bite". As I reached for it my elbow bumped the can and not ONE SINGLE NUT fell into the space between the flap handle and the tunnel.....
By actual count it was about 36 of them which slipped the surly bonds of that can and promptly descended beneath the footless halls of that tunnel.
Our next fuel stop was Mena, AR where "WingNut" (Del Lehmann) met us and arranged a car for our lunch (and a discount for our fuel.) Del also has excellent connections with local upholstery shops, and he arranged for one of them to manufacture a leather boot for my flap handle.
The tunnel cover can be removed to install the boot, and it is glued to the underside of that cover. It took far less time and effort than the two hours to find all 36 nuts.
Yes. I know. It's not original. But sometimes you have to ASK YOURSELF is it better TO BE an originality-nut ?.... OR NOT TO BE a half-day contorted in wierd positions looking for your nuts?
"Loop" pile carpet is not a good candidate for airplanes, in my opinion. The loops can catch on items like sliding seats, cargo, some belt-clasps, etc., and pull-out or destroy the loop(s) leaving your carpet with a damaged appearance.
Short "cut" pile is best for airplanes, the best material being natural fibers such as wool or horsehair (if you can find it.) The Model T Ford collectors use an excellent replacement product which mimics horsehair but is made of wool. It makes a good carpet because it looks like what Cessna originally installed, it wears well and passes the burn test.
My carpet is made of that, and was cut and serged by an upholstery shop.
Serging can be done in several ways, the most common being a "whipped" serge/edging, done by sewing-machine. This looks nice and can be closely matched to the carpet base-color...but it has a disadvantage....the whipping cord/threads suffer the same fate as loop-pile carpet. They can "catch" and be torn loose, leaving you with a raggedy-looking edge which detracts from the appearance. Alongside seat tracks that type of serging usually wears quickly and becomes unsightly.
Another method is to use "serging tape" ....which is similar to what seamstresses use called "sizing tape". Carpet makers are usually familiar with it. Some of it is self-adhesive (I don't like that)...the best method is to have it sewn to the edge of the carpet. This is much more durable than other methods, in my opinion, and is how mine was done.
The carpet on the tunnel can be carefully cut, serged and and glued directly to the non-removeable portions of the tunnel....and can be glued to the cover or left loose in other areas (as well as the main area of carpet which will be regularly removed during inspections) then can be screwed or velcroed directly to the floor. My main carpet is actually loose on the floor, being held in position by the rear seat, pilot seats, tracks, and pilot/co-pilot pedal scuff-pads which are stainless plates screwed to the floor.
To better illustrate this method, here's a pic of the tunnel cover and flap-handle area...as well as a shot of the main floor directly behind the pilot's seat, alongside the seat track.
You might also notice the flap-handle "boot" I have. In order to discourage rodents searching for scraps, as Captain of my ship, I don't allow anyone to eat food in the airplane.
This rule is sometimes ignored by the Admiral, and on the way to Benton-Harbor last year she pulled a can of mixed nuts out of her purse and began to open it up. I stopped her and told her why I didn't want anythng other than water or coffee consumed in-flight. She gave me big sad eyes and promised not to drop a SINGLE NUT in the airplane...and I detailed again how important I thought keeping mice out of stored airplanes can be, in order to further emphasize how important I thought it that she not drop a SINGLE nut...as doubtless it would roll around and drop below the floor making it almost impossible to find/remove.
Sad eyes won.
The can was opened, and as a gesture of good-will...she held the can towards me in an offer of "first bite". As I reached for it my elbow bumped the can and not ONE SINGLE NUT fell into the space between the flap handle and the tunnel.....
By actual count it was about 36 of them which slipped the surly bonds of that can and promptly descended beneath the footless halls of that tunnel.
Our next fuel stop was Mena, AR where "WingNut" (Del Lehmann) met us and arranged a car for our lunch (and a discount for our fuel.) Del also has excellent connections with local upholstery shops, and he arranged for one of them to manufacture a leather boot for my flap handle.
The tunnel cover can be removed to install the boot, and it is glued to the underside of that cover. It took far less time and effort than the two hours to find all 36 nuts.
Yes. I know. It's not original. But sometimes you have to ASK YOURSELF is it better TO BE an originality-nut ?.... OR NOT TO BE a half-day contorted in wierd positions looking for your nuts?
'53 B-model N146YS SN:25713
50th Anniversary of Flight Model. Winner-Best Original 170B, 100th Anniversary of Flight Convention.
An originality nut (mostly) for the right reasons.
50th Anniversary of Flight Model. Winner-Best Original 170B, 100th Anniversary of Flight Convention.
An originality nut (mostly) for the right reasons.
Re: Carpet on the tunnel
George,
Thats a pretty long story and I read the whole thing. However, I was rerribly disappointed that you left us hanging about the result of the nut spill and the vast herd (?) of varmints thereby attracted, and the fierce job you had fighting for possession of your beloved C-170B airplane.
Thats a pretty long story and I read the whole thing. However, I was rerribly disappointed that you left us hanging about the result of the nut spill and the vast herd (?) of varmints thereby attracted, and the fierce job you had fighting for possession of your beloved C-170B airplane.
BL
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Re: Carpet on the tunnel
I used some strips of velcro to hold the tunnel cover down, that way I can ake the whole thing off if I want to. i have to say though that George made his look a bit nicer.
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Re: Carpet on the tunnel
I was so impressed with George's tunnel cover and flap handle boot that i decided to try to duplicate it on my onw aircaft. The tunnel cover on my aircraft was completely carpeted over by the previous owner - there is no way to remove the cover without cutting it out of the carpet. I went looking for, but could not find a part number for the tunnel cover - is there one? Also, from the looks of my tunnel cover and flap handle it seems like the flap handle must be removed from the tunnel in order to remove the tunnel cover?
Thx
Thx
"You have to learn how to fall before you learn how to fly"
Re: Carpet on the tunnel
Fort the
The tunnel cover is PN 0510185 Figures 35, 36 or 36A depending your serial number.
You don't have to remove the flap handle as it will slide over the handle quite easily.
George, the leather flap-wrap you have is right up there with sliced bread on the neat scale
I plan to fully pirate the idea. With any luck, I'll take some pictures of making it and will share them here.
I did buy the airtext carpet kit so, that greatly simplified the floor....well worth every penny IMO
I plan to carefully trim the tunnel carpet to size and have a local shop serge it as recommended. Then use some velcro to hold it down.
Also, can someone tell me the text on the placard behind the flap handle? PN 0511168 Fg 36
Cheers,
-David
The tunnel cover is PN 0510185 Figures 35, 36 or 36A depending your serial number.
You don't have to remove the flap handle as it will slide over the handle quite easily.
George, the leather flap-wrap you have is right up there with sliced bread on the neat scale
I plan to fully pirate the idea. With any luck, I'll take some pictures of making it and will share them here.
I did buy the airtext carpet kit so, that greatly simplified the floor....well worth every penny IMO
I plan to carefully trim the tunnel carpet to size and have a local shop serge it as recommended. Then use some velcro to hold it down.
Also, can someone tell me the text on the placard behind the flap handle? PN 0511168 Fg 36
Cheers,
-David
- Bruce Fenstermacher
- Posts: 10324
- Joined: Tue Apr 23, 2002 11:24 am
Re: Carpet on the tunnel
Dave if someone doesn't chime in with the placard I'll check my collection of placard pictures at home. I know I have it.
CAUTION - My forum posts may be worth what you paid for them!
Bruce Fenstermacher, Past President, TIC170A
Email: brucefenster at gmail.com
Bruce Fenstermacher, Past President, TIC170A
Email: brucefenster at gmail.com
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Re: Carpet on the tunnel
Would you post them all? I would be curious to see them.Bruce Fenstermacher wrote:Dave if someone doesn't chime in with the placard I'll check my collection of placard pictures at home. I know I have it.
- Bruce Fenstermacher
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- Joined: Tue Apr 23, 2002 11:24 am
Re: Carpet on the tunnel
Woops, busy today. I'll look tomorrow morning.
JR, I'll consider it. They are pretty boring really. Sometimes I'd take 6 or 7 shots of the same thing just trying to get the least distortion. Or I only took a good enough photo to show the placard was used on a given year aircraft when I already had a better example from another. Another project I started that is in process.
JR, I'll consider it. They are pretty boring really. Sometimes I'd take 6 or 7 shots of the same thing just trying to get the least distortion. Or I only took a good enough photo to show the placard was used on a given year aircraft when I already had a better example from another. Another project I started that is in process.
CAUTION - My forum posts may be worth what you paid for them!
Bruce Fenstermacher, Past President, TIC170A
Email: brucefenster at gmail.com
Bruce Fenstermacher, Past President, TIC170A
Email: brucefenster at gmail.com
Re: Carpet on the tunnel
It took a while but, I have the tunnel all trimmed up.
I first cut the trim wheel hole and a slot for the flaps.
Measure twice, cut 50 little slices until it looks right
Once I had the trim wheel how I wanted it, I screwed down the flap cover over the carpet to hold it in place.
Then, carefully trimmed the sides until they fit flat.
Don't measure a few spots and try to cut a straight line. The floor isnt flat. It has two angles to it ( or, my plane has been seriously tweaked in the past).
FYI The cut-outs drawn on the airtext carpet are not to be taken seriously. Measure your own carpet, don't trust the marking!
I was able to bind the cut edges pretty well with out sewing machine and a fairly tight zigzag patten. I think I went thru 10 bobbins. It's not perfect but, you shouldnt see it much anyway.
I should get some pics up here.
I first cut the trim wheel hole and a slot for the flaps.
Measure twice, cut 50 little slices until it looks right
Once I had the trim wheel how I wanted it, I screwed down the flap cover over the carpet to hold it in place.
Then, carefully trimmed the sides until they fit flat.
Don't measure a few spots and try to cut a straight line. The floor isnt flat. It has two angles to it ( or, my plane has been seriously tweaked in the past).
FYI The cut-outs drawn on the airtext carpet are not to be taken seriously. Measure your own carpet, don't trust the marking!
I was able to bind the cut edges pretty well with out sewing machine and a fairly tight zigzag patten. I think I went thru 10 bobbins. It's not perfect but, you shouldnt see it much anyway.
I should get some pics up here.
Re: Carpet on the tunnel
The "37 gal useable" is not an original placard, the other one is.bagarre wrote: Also, can someone tell me the text on the placard behind the flap handle? PN 0511168 Fg 36
Gary
- Bruce Fenstermacher
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- Joined: Tue Apr 23, 2002 11:24 am
Re: Carpet on the tunnel
An original '51 Fuel Selector and Placard.
An original '53 Fuel Selector and Placard.
Sorry David, I don't have a photo of a '52 but it is the same as the '51 and '53
CAUTION - My forum posts may be worth what you paid for them!
Bruce Fenstermacher, Past President, TIC170A
Email: brucefenster at gmail.com
Bruce Fenstermacher, Past President, TIC170A
Email: brucefenster at gmail.com
Re: Carpet on the tunnel
Thanks for all the pics!
On another note, does anyone know if Gorilla glue is nice to aluminum?
IE: will it promote corrosion?
Might be worth another thread but, I want to use it to glue the velcro to the tunnel.
On another note, does anyone know if Gorilla glue is nice to aluminum?
IE: will it promote corrosion?
Might be worth another thread but, I want to use it to glue the velcro to the tunnel.