Questions from a new pilot

[islandaviator]

Helo all,
I just completed my training for my private license, and am looking for a plane to buy for my family. I am in love with the c-170's, but i have no tailwheel time orexperience. Would you guyd recommend a new pilot to buy a tailwheel aircraft? My instucter is tailwheel endorsed so i have no issue with instruction. I plan to fly my family (wife 2 kids) on cross country.s and so forth. Is this the plane for me? Any help or suggestions are appreciated.

[doug8082a]

I don't think you'd have a problem. I got my ticket in 1999 and had 110 hrs TT when I got my TW signoff anf promptly bought the 170. Get a good instructor, practice/practice/practice (and then practice some more), learn your personal limitations and stay within them and you'll do fine.

[Stinson driver]

Shoudnt be a problem- I did my PPL on a Tiger Moth and Starduster
My C170 is a pussycat when compared to those two- I still dont have nose wheel rating

Doug South Africa

[Bruce Fenstermacher]

You should be fine learning the ways of a tail-dragger. You mention your instructor has a tail wheel sign off. I hope he has much more than that. There is no hour requirement for the sign off so your instructor could have only the time it took him to show competency in one particular aircraft.

What your looking for is an instructor with a few hundred hours of tail wheel time and hopefully some recent experience in the tail wheel aircraft you buy.

I've got about 800 hours tail wheel time and have flown about eight different types of tail wheel aircraft. I can tell you about the only thing the eight have in common is a tail wheel.

The 170 is a good family plane. But like all other aircraft in it's class, it will get a little cramped when the kids get bigger.

[N170CT]

FWIW...I have flown super cubs, citabrias, great lakes biplanes, 140s and 170s and Bruce is dead on regarding the differences. My suggestion for a low time pilot is to seek some training in the 170 if at all possible by someone with experience in more than one type. The Citabria is much too easy to fly/land compared to a 170. The great lakes, flown from the aft cockpit, gives away all forward visibility at flare, yet its oleo strut does a much better job of absorbing the landing shock than the 170. Though "Tailwheel Endorsed" when I purchased my 170, I spent the first four hours with a very experienced instructor in my "new" airplane before venturing out solo. It was time well spent . Good luck to ya,
chuck

[mrpibb]

I had 1.2 hrs pic after getting my private ticket when I started flying mine. I had bought my 170 before I got my licsence but I didnt fly it due to the extensive anual I was performing. Bottom line you will be fine.

[Romeo Tango]

I echo and emphasize that find an instructor with time in the C170, or perhaps the C180 Skywagon. The C170 is a wonderful machine, but it is different than "training" conventional airplanes (Citabria). As a CFI, I don't have an issue teaching in most tricycle gear aircraft in which I have little time (weight & equipment respected) - but am not interested in teaching in tailwheel make/models in which I am green. Too many nuances and "room for discovery".

When I bought my C170 my instructor and I (we are both CFIs) took it out and cautiously explored the envelope. He had a good amount of C180 time, and a few hours of C170 time in the long distant past. Together we figured out the airplane (not that much to figure out, it's just different). We never scared ourselves, but we did find some interesting things around stalls and slow flight.

[cessna170bdriver]

We never scared ourselves, but we did find some interesting things around stalls and slow flight.

It's been covered in these forums several times but is worth repeating: Heed the admonition in the owners manual against slips with full flaps in the B-model. I missed that detail, and it took me about a year but I discovered it the (almost) hard way. The nose may not go STRAIGHT down, but it sure feels that way when you aren't expecting it. Fortunately, relaxing the slip effected a quick enough recovery.

Bottom line: if you have full flaps and are STILL going to land long, you've already blown the landing. GO AROUND.

Miles

[lowNslow]

Bottom line: if you have full flaps and are STILL going to land long, you've already blown the landing. GO AROUND.

Miles

As the Southwest pilots say: Don't worry, we may be high, but we have lots of airspeed.

[pif_sonic]

islandaviator,

I bought a 1964 Cessna 150D to get my license in. I put about 175 hours on the 150. I just sold it to get a bigger plane. A few days ago I bought a 1951 Cessna 170A. I now have 2 hours in it. I was very concerned about transitioning from the tri-gear to the tail wheel. Only after two hours, I am very glad I bought the 170. I only have one child and one wife (HEHEHE) I believe the 170 will do everything I need for my family. I don’t want a faster airplane. If everybody loves to fly so much, why get a faster airplane, so you are in the air less time. Makes no sense to me.

Anyway I jumped n with both feet and with no tail wheel time.

Wayne

[N4653B]

Helo all,
Would you guyd recommend a new pilot to buy a tailwheel aircraft? My instucter is tailwheel endorsed so i have no issue with instruction.

Absolutely. Consider the fact that thousands of people learned to fly in 120/140's, 170's and 180's....it's certainly appropriate. I just want to echo and emphasize the need for a good instructor who knows his way around a TW cessna. The typical CFI who got a citabria checkout isn't going to have the requisite skills and experience to teach you what you need to know.

Good Luck and happy hunting,

Bill

[GAHorn]

Miles' comment is a certainly valid. (Think abou this: The tailfeathers provide a downward "lift" to balance the fuselage about the fulcrum of the wing's lift. Got it? Ok, so here comes the relative wind blowing off the big flaps of a B-model. Those flaps are all the way down. The relative wind coming off those big flaps is blowing downward. Hard. (Think of the entire airplane being upside down and the tailfeathers making lift and here comes relative wind, hard, from below, ...like a continuous updraft.) It tries to stalls the tail.
Now the pilot introduces some slip. In a slip, the fuselage blanks out one side (or the other) of the tailfeathers. Now only HALF as much tail is receiving relative wind.... the other side is completely blanked out. Suddenly the tail is not big enough for the airplane and the nose falls, abruptly. All the way. The windshield is full of terra firma.
Don't slip with full flaps in a B model.

But other than violating that placarded warning of slipping with Full Flaps.... The B model is a pussy-cat. And the flaps are so big, you'll not need to do slips anyway. Piece of cake. You'll love it.

[R COLLINS]

Get a 170A and you won't have to worry about it, plus they are faster!!!

[GAHorn]

Get a 170A and you won't have to worry about it, plus they are faster!!!

Yeah. But only on final!

[blueldr]

What in hell is all the fuss about learning to fly in a tail wheel airplane?
Keep in mind that every pilot prior to and through WWII learned in a tail wheel airplqane. That was an awful lot lot of aviators! I personally never flew a nose wheel airplane until I got into a B-25 in 1944. I thought it was weird as hell!
Below are some of the WWII trainers, all of which had conventional landing gear. (Tail Wheels)

Primary= PT-11,PT-13,PT-14, PT-15, PT-16, PT-17, PT-18, PT-19, PT-20, PT-21, PT-22, PT-23, PT-25, PT-26, PT27

Basic = BT-9, BT-13, BT-14, BT-15

Advanced= AT-6, AT-7, AT-8, AT-9, AT-10, AT-11, AT-12, AT-16, AT-17 (UC-78), AT-18, AT-19, AT-20

We trained many thousands of pilots on those airplanes, including me.

Actually, I believe there were some nose wheel trainers used in WWI, but
that was a little before my time. (But not much!)