Cessna 210 Starter Slow New Battery, New Starter still slow

[blueldr]

But it's still not cheap!

[johneeb]

But it's still not cheap!

Dick, are you going to Idaho this year?

[j3pup]

That does sound right... I guess I need the adapter.

[j3pup]

New starter, new starter adapter, new cables, added a ground to engine block, and it's still not
turning it over well. I am going to take it to the recyclers soon.

[marathonrunner]

Just been reading this and all the replies. Do you have a ground cable, and a large one, from the engine to airframe ground? I know I have found that to be a problem.

[FredMa]

I understand your frustration but this is a very simple system and fairly easy to troubleshoot. I believe you should start over and re-check everything. I can and have installed new (bad) parts while troubleshooting inducing new problems or the same problem again. I would troubleshoot as follows. Remove you battery and recharge it. check it's charged voltage, should be around 13.2 volts. With the battery out, check the resistance from the neg, terminal to ground, should be very low, .2 ohms or so. With the battery in place connect the battery cables but disconnect the positive cable from the battery solenoid as well as the small wire that is on the same terminal of the battery solenoid ( this is the positive wire that energizes the solenoid with the master switch on) Leave these two wires touching each other(maybe tywrap them together) but don't let them touch ground. This will let you turn on your master switch and have the battery solenoid energize while the positive cable is not connected. Now check resistence across the large terminals of the battery solenoid. should be very low resistence, .1 or .2 max. This is what I suspect is most likely your problem. current to your starter while starting has to go through this battery solenoid and also for charging your battery. Probably has burnt contacts. You can verify it is bad before spending more money on parts you don't need. It is a fairly cheap part.

[blueldr]

Did you ever check the voltage on the terminal lug on the starter while you were cranking?

[j3pup]

Marathonrunner -- Yup added a ground from the battery ground cable to the engine block.
Blueldr-- Going to try that today
FredMa-- Some good ideas, I am going to check in your post thanks.

I do notice that when I charge the battery its up to like 13.6, when I come back the next day its 12.9. If I apply jumper cables past the master switch solenoid to my pickup truck running, i can hear my alternator take a load and the prop does the same thing.


I appreciate everyone's ideas I know I will get it eventually, it's just going to take persistence.

[FredMa]

The 13.6 is probably correct if you are using a slow charger. your alternator should charge at around 14.25 or so. Each battery cell is 2.2v fully charged or 13.2 for 6 healthy cells. charging voltage has to be above this to reverse the battery's polarity, which is what you are doing to charge it. Not sure if you are talking about hooking up a jumper cable to the battery side of the solenoid or the starter side, I assume you mean the starter side. How well does it turn the starter like that?

[marathonrunner]

On the jumper cable thing, Are have you tried just a fully charged good battery direct? I mean the positive on the starter lug and the negative on a bolt for ground. Then put the positive on the battery and then connect the ground and see if it does anything different?

Just a thought but that would at least get you started on the correct end. Another problem I have had but does not sound like you have is that sometimes you have correct voltage reading going into a circuit breaker and not the correct reading coming out. I have only had something like this a half dozen times but the latest was on an Aero Commander twin that had a heater not working. I unfortunately started at the wrong end and went to the breaker last but, you gotta start somewhere:)

This is an interesting problem I would love to be able to come help troubleshoot this but am unable at this time to do something like that

Keep us informed and good luck with it...happy troubleshooting... I think it was Edison who said "I know a hundred ways to not make a light bulb"

[marathonrunner]

Darn I just read through all again. Sounds like you have two problems. One is not charging and the other is slow to turn the prop. Yes you should have power to the field on the regulator. In fact just for test purposes you can take the regulator out of the system and hook a hot wire directly to the field terminal of the alternator. The charge should follow engine RPM. If it does that then you have a regulator problem.

That being said I do not see how that could affect starting speed. Also check at your buss for possible problems with a voltmeter and check all those terminals too. I do not have a 210 manual handy as I am not at home. They are fairly straightforward though. What model and year is it?

[hilltop170]

I'm sure you have already thought of this but what voltage is the 210 starter?

[j3pup]

I am going to run a bunch more tests tonight and will report back later. Starter is a 12 volt starter rebuilt from AeroTech of Louisville as George recommended them. Starter drive is one of their rebuilt units too. I also have my old starter that did the same thing. This all started after we replaced the brushes in the old starter and replaced it on the aircraft. The prop spun great for like 4 starts and then it started getting worse and worse ending in what we have now. I can't imagine changing brushes started this. I think I have the alternator problem figured out, as the voltage regulator I had replaced the bad one with was bad too. I now have voltage on all 3 prongs as I should. The only thing is I can't check if the alternator will work as I can't start the airplane hah. I am going to entertain the possibility that I have two bad batteries tonight, and take the measurements described here on the starter when cranking etc...

[GAHorn]

You never answered my question I asked some time ago: did you truly install a NEW battery? or merely another/different one?

Have you pulled the prop thru by hand to see if any stiffness (from bad bearings, etc.) is present?
Exactly what RPM will the engine indicate when rotated by the starter?

[j3pup]

It was a brand new battery George, I apologize for not answering that. Prop pulls through fine. Just noticed a little smoke coming out of my new starter, where the hot lead connects. I wonder if it's just the new pair and oil or if I got a bad starter? The starter will turn it over with a few turns of the key but it's not enough of anything to get it going.