Bulk fuel handling and storage

flat country pilot · Post by **flat country pilot** » Fri Apr 21, 2006 12:03 pm

I have a 250 gallon steel fuel tank and trailer I want to use for 100LL. I bought this used from a guy who had it custom built for fueling planes and it is a real nice little unit. It has a fire extinguisher and ground wire mounted to the trailer.

Will 100LL eat a regular farm duty gasoline hose and pump?

I was told to put a brass nozzle on to avoid sparks. Is this a good idea and where does a guy find a brass nozzle?

Do you guys always ground your plane when you fuel it? When I buy fuel where some fuel jocky fuels my plane, seems to me the more experienced line guys skip the ground wire. The new line guys tend to clamp it on paint which seems worthless to me. I always wonder if the guy with 20 years of experience hasn't had the experience that is waiting for him.

Otherwise, I buy fuel from ag pilots at a couple small strips. They don't have ground wires but one does use a brass nozzle.

Do any of you store bulk fuel and do you keep it near your hangar, in your hangar, or far away?

Is there any difference between 100LL and car gas when transporting this trailer down a road?

Bill

Bill Hart · Post by **Bill Hart** » Fri Apr 21, 2006 12:24 pm

I have a tank but it is quite a bit larger than yours. I do not have a brass nozzle but I do ground the plane. In the military we ground the jets before refueling using JP-8 witch has a much higher flash point than gas so I would say you should ground the airplane before refuelingâ€¦..for what thatâ€™s worth.

flat country pilot · Post by **flat country pilot** » Fri Apr 21, 2006 12:43 pm

Thanks for the reply.

When I ground the plane, I am grounding the plane to the trailer and fuel tank. Since these are both on tires, the only connection to earth is the jack on the trailer hitch. Is your larger tank on a trailer or sitting on the soil?

Bill

cessna170bdriver · Post by **cessna170bdriver** » Fri Apr 21, 2006 1:12 pm

As long as the airplane and fuel nozzle are electrically connected to each other, there will be no voltage difference between the two and no possibility of a spark. If you plan on laying the nozzle on the ground, then you might also want to make some provision for grounding the trailer.

I generally use the exhaust stack as a ground point on the airplane. It isn't painted and should be electrically well connected to the rest of the airplane.

Miles

Bill Hart · Post by **Bill Hart** » Fri Apr 21, 2006 2:45 pm

Bill,

My tank is 2000 gal and is grounded with a six foot copper rod into the earth. Again in the military we ground the airplane to the earth and the truck to the same earth ground then the airplane to the truck. Personally I think this is overkill and don't go through all of that for my airplane. I just put it on the exhaust stack from the tank as previously mentioned.

Post by **GAHorn** » Fri Apr 21, 2006 3:51 pm

100 avgas should not bother other "gasoline" fuel hoses. (mogas is much more aggressive than genuine aviation gasoline.)

A brass fuel nozzle is the expensive non-sparking kind. Most refueling nozzles are the cheaper aluminum,.... also non-sparking when struck against steel or mineral (rock/concrete) surfaces.

I always confirm that I've grounded my plane to the refueler. This is done by pressing the "Enter" button on the membrane-pad.

(my bad)

I never attach it to my exhaust system. (I cringe whenever I see lineboys clamp that scratch-inducing/stress-riser inducing alligator clamp onto my $2K exhaust system.) I attach it to either my tie-down rings or my tow-eye rings on the landing gear, or to a cad-plated axle-bolt on the landing gear.

I never store more than 42 gallons (37 useable) of gasoline in my hangar. Except for the eight five-gallon jerry cans I keep my spare fuel in. And the ten gallons in the 9N Ford tractor. And the 3 gallons in the Harley. And 2 gallons in the emergency generator. And the 2 quarts in each of: lawn mower, garden tiller, power-washer. And the 22 gallons of varnish in the fuel tanks of Ol' GAR's C-150 over in the corner.

There is no difference in hauling mogas and avgas down the highway.

The fire extinguisher is not for putting out the conflagration of 150 gallons of gasoline in the refueler. It's for putting out the 8 ounces or so that's feeding those roaring flames coming up your shirt-sleeve and beginning to consume the fat in your nose and cheeks and boil your eyeballs. Keep it very handy. Practice pointing it at yourself.

cessna170bdriver · Post by **cessna170bdriver** » Fri Apr 21, 2006 4:40 pm

gahorn wrote: Keep [the fire extinguisher] very handy. Practice pointing it at yourself.

With the pin still installed, of course!

LEA · Post by **LEA** » Fri Apr 21, 2006 11:50 pm

Bill ;I have been using Auto fuel in my planes since 1977 .I installed a 110 gallon tank on a trailer with a Golden Rod fuel filter (A must) and enough hose to reach both tanks without moving the trailer ,which is stored in the hanger under the extreme far wing.I ground the airplane from the tiedown ring to the steel support posts of the hangar.I secure another ground wire from the refueler tank to the same tiedown ring on the airplane.This percaution is necessary because the hose we are using is not that which is installed at refueling stations with a wire running the length of the hose inside the Neoprene cover & braid.
We had an experience a few weeks ago ,when a pilot in another hangar was refueling his C182 from a 55 gallon drum using a diaphram pump and
he developed a static spark that ignited the vapors on top of the drum.
Fortunately he was able to extinguish the flame before any damage was done.He now knows to ground the drum and his plane.
Be careful out there!
BOB

flat country pilot · Post by **flat country pilot** » Sat Apr 22, 2006 11:17 am

Miles,

Such wisdom.

I was already thinking about where I would recharge the extinguisher.

Really, thanks for all the input.

Bill

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futr_alaskaflyer · Post by **futr_alaskaflyer** » Sun Apr 23, 2006 9:07 am

IF your fuel tank nozzle is not grounded through the hose (highly unlikely - I doubt a standard ag-fuel hose has integral grounding like more expensive fueling systems) then I would beg you to attach a grounding wire from the tank to your plane while fueling

flat country pilot · Post by **flat country pilot** » Sun Apr 23, 2006 1:27 pm

futr_alaskaflyer

We have a few storage and transfer tanks and I always buy grounded hose, even for diesel. But, I am still going to ground the plane to the fuel trailer.

Congrats on 3477C

Will your user name change to curr_alaskaflyer?

Bill

cessna170bdriver · Post by **cessna170bdriver** » Sun Apr 23, 2006 4:18 pm

3477C eh? I'd say the serial number is 26520? Probably a factory mate of my 3498C, sn 26541.

Miles

futr_alaskaflyer · Post by **futr_alaskaflyer** » Sun Apr 23, 2006 7:29 pm

flat country pilot wrote:futr_alaskaflyer

We have a few storage and transfer tanks and I always buy grounded hose, even for diesel. But, I am still going to ground the plane to the fuel trailer.

Congrats on 3477C
Will your user name change to curr_alaskaflyer?

Bill

Good deal. While at flight school for my private a while ago I witnessed a flash fire at the self serve - we got the fire out before the plane burned down, but the pilot spent time at a burn center for some painful rehabilitation of 2nd degree burns on his arms.

I plan on initially using 5 gallon cans for autofuel, and I am trying to decide the best way to mitigate the spark hazard.

I don't think you can change your user name

- besides, I will always be a future Alaska flyer if you consider the metaphysics of the situation, except maybe on the last day I leave the state (and then there is the promise held out for the future - and armchair flying too)

Post by **GAHorn** » Mon Apr 24, 2006 6:46 am

Be careful with mogas. Latest rumors are that ethanol is becoming standard additive, all across the country. This will likely increase the amount of water absorbed by the fuel. (and the type certificate for our airplanes prohibit it in the fuel.)